Anthony Bourdain on ethnic food

[Jenise]

I love this:

"Look," said Ali, an Egyptian/American chef, pointing at a plateful of traditional Alexandrian food in his Queens restaurant. "The history of the world."
He had just put in extraordinarily succinct terms what any well traveled eater, student of ethnic or national food ways -- or serious food nerd has come to know: that what is on your plate, the choice or selection, or preferences -- or ingredients -- almost any place you are eating, are the end result of movements of people and resources, the punch line of a story usually involving (at some point in history), deprivation, starvation, colonialism, slavery, greed, and warfare. No need for us to get all depressed about that.

The end result of the above -- at least (and only) as far as cuisine -- is more often than not, good.

[Robin Garr]

Ali, an Egyptian/American chef, pointing at a plateful of traditional Alexandrian food in his Queens restaurant.

Ali on Steinway! We used to eat there a LOT! It was best at the times when his grandmother would come over from Egypt and help cook while she was there.

Oh, jeez! Spare me the effing liberal angst politics.

Nearly all of what haute cuisine calls "delicacies" was originally peasant food created out of sheer desperation.

Brains, sweetbreads, liver, kidneys, chitterlings, tripe--all consumed by the peasants because their "betters" had scarfed up the muscle flesh. Lobster? There were prison riots in New England protesting the fact that they were served the "vermin" (their words) several times a week.

And a couple of generations later, the rich with more money than they know what to do with are paying premium prices for what our ancestors considered food of last resort--to be eaten only because nothing else is available.

So now your average family dines on what used to be reserved for the nobility, and the rich who can afford it seek out and rhapsodize on what used to be peasant food.

-Paul W.

Oh, jeez! Spare me the effing liberal angst politics.

So now your average family dines on what used to be reserved for the nobility, and the rich who can afford it seek out and rhapsodize on what used to be peasant food.

-Paul W.

See, you call it liberal angst politics. I call it cool.

As the original quote said, and I agree, "no need for us to get all depressed about that."

Many very great dishes were born out of desperation. Coq au Vin, for example: What do you do when the rooster gets too old to perform his henhouse duties? You can't roast the old bird--meat's too tough for that. So you simmer it for a long time in lots of acidic wine, to make it tender enough to eat. And you stretch a single bird for a big family by adding onions, potatoes, and mushrooms.

And the result, born originally out of frugal necessity, is pure culinary heaven.

-Paul W.

Paul, Bourdain wouldn't disagree with you. The original quote is rather class-neutral. Your upset seems out of place to me.

The other thing I find cute is the word "ethnic food". I grew up in a Chinese household, where the oven was used to store plates, and everything was cooked in a hot wok, or a steamer, or a slow cooker. And that was while being raised in Australia! So to me, ethnic food really is the stuff my anglo husband grew up on - roasts, cakes, cold cereal with milk. I can't tell you how appalled I was the first time I tried rice pudding - ugh.

The only thing I wish is that "peasant food" still cost what it used to - have you seen the price of puy lentils?

A funny, off-topic anecdote for you. Many years ago, I (jokingly) wanted to write a cookbook for all us immigrants, entitled "White Food". I was going to start it with Pete's grandmother's recipe for making a roast. She was the coolest old lady in the universe. When I, at 19, asked her how to prepare a roast, she said, "well, the way I used to do it was to rub oil and salt on a piece of bolar blade, then put it in a tray in the oven. Then you set the timer, go sailing for the day, and come home and take it out."

I had to look up what a 'bolar blade' is.

I never got the hang of cold cereal, either, if that's any satisfaction.

[Jenise]

The other thing I find cute is the word "ethnic food". I grew up in a Chinese household, where the oven was used to store plates, and everything was cooked in a hot wok, or a steamer, or a slow cooker. And that was while being raised in Australia! So to me, ethnic food really is the stuff my anglo husband grew up on - roasts, cakes, cold cereal with milk. I can't tell you how appalled I was the first time I tried rice pudding - ugh.

In the U.S., "ethnic food" isn't a put-down at all, I hope it doesn't come across that way. Rather, it's an admiring term for the food of a single cultural group, be that race or country of origin, that is very specifically their personal cuisine, which is very different and to be envied vs. the unspecific mutt or 'white' food as you put it most of us of dubious mixed European heritage grew up on. I'm probably quite typical in that I'm a plain white mutt. No idea who my ancestors were or where we came from, and with no food heritage or tradition beyond whatever my mother learned to cook along the way because her parents were meat and potatoes farm people. Or to put it another way, ethnic = better than what I came from and it's the food I and many people like me (the former white majority) seek out when we go out to eat. I have no cultural food heritage, there is no cuisine that my family considers our own. That's got to be about as bad as it gets. So when I use the term "ethnic cuisine", it doesn't mean "what's not white" but any cuisine with a rich and long history. Yes, Chinese would be one of those, but so would Polish and Russian.

[Jenise]

Oh, jeez! Spare me the effing liberal angst politics.

Nearly all of what haute cuisine calls "delicacies" was originally peasant food created out of sheer desperation.

Oh, Paul. Spare me the conservative hegemonial expletives. Which is not something I would normally say, but you make it neccessary for me to return the insult, as it were in order to show you how offbase and unwelcome I think your comment is. Frankly, I don't see where anything Tony said is actually contrary to your complaint.

In the U.S., "ethnic food" isn't a put-down at all, I hope it doesn't come across that way. Rather, it's an admiring term for the food of a single cultural group, be that race or country of origin, that is very specifically their personal cuisine, which is very different and to be envied vs. the unspecific mutt or 'white' food as you put it most of us of dubious mixed European heritage grew up on. I'm probably quite typical in that I'm a plain white mutt. No idea who my ancestors were or where we came from, and with no food heritage or tradition beyond whatever my mother learned to cook along the way because her parents were meat and potatoes farm people. Or to put it another way, ethnic = better than what I came from and it's the food I and many people like me (the former white majority) seek out when we go out to eat. I have no cultural food heritage, there is no cuisine that my family considers our own. That's got to be about as bad as it gets. So when I use the term "ethnic cuisine", it doesn't mean "what's not white" but any cuisine with a rich and long history. Yes, Chinese would be one of those, but so would Polish and Russian.

Oh, I didn't mean it as a bad thing, and I certainly didn't mean any offence by the "white food" comment - apologies if anyone took umbrage. What I was amused by was the definer "ethnic" - I see anglosaxon food as a very specific cuisine, so to me, it's ethnic food (well, less so now, but certainly when I was young). I used to watch Delia's cooking classes with great interest - dishes like Beef Wellington had me amazed.

Jenise, I'm sure we're all a melting pot of cultures, but there is no way that I would ever consider you a "plain white mutt". There are going to be future generations of WLDGers referring to "Jenise" cuisine. (Actually,there already is. How often do we hear someone say, "I made xyz a la Jenise today"...)

I certainly didn't mean any offence by the "white food" comment - apologies if anyone took umbrage.

Isn't umbrage the opposite of white?

I certainly didn't mean any offence by the "white food" comment - apologies if anyone took umbrage.

Isn't umbrage the opposite of white?

Would that be "Burnt Umbrage"?

I grew up in a Chinese household, where the oven was used to store plates, and everything was cooked in a hot wok, or a steamer, or a slow cooker.

That must have been some tasty birthday cake that was made in a wok, steamer or slow cooker.

[Jenise]

Oh, I didn't mean it as a bad thing, and I certainly didn't mean any offence by the "white food" comment - apologies if anyone took umbrage. What I was amused by was the definer "ethnic" - I see anglosaxon food as a very specific cuisine, so to me

I took no umbrage, I was only concerned from what you said that you thought 'ethnic' only applied to non-white cultures.

I wonder if Australia's primarily British heritage makes what you call "anglosaxon" food there more specific and narrow? Here, though there are regional differences, especially to someone growing up in Southern California as I did it's all one big jumble: I grew up on everything from steak, pasta, chinese food, German sausages, Jewish pastrami on rye, southern fried chicken and Mexican combo plates to a lot of 50's and 60's dishes that my mother got ahold of somewhere along the way, like Swiss Steak. There was zero, and I do mean zero, family food tradition based on our ancestors--whoever they were. It went no further back than my mother's mother, who was a simple meat and potatoes cook from a poor farming family.

Jenise, I'm sure we're all a melting pot of cultures, but there is no way that I would ever consider you a "plain white mutt". There are going to be future generations of WLDGers referring to "Jenise" cuisine.[/quote]

Aren't you sweet. But I'm serious about the white mutt part: I'm green with envy of people like John Tomasso who grew up in a strong Italian New York family and Ines who was actually born in Germany and you who are Chinese--all of you have inherited a culture, a set of traditions culinarily speaking based on who your parents were and where they were from. Me? Zip. Nada. I only consider myself lucky to have grown up in a large city where some of the foods of other cultures became everyday foods for our family.

Aren't you sweet. But I'm serious about the white mutt part: I'm green with envy of people like John Tomasso who grew up in a strong Italian New York family and Ines who was actually born in Germany and you who are Chinese--all of you have inherited a culture, a set of traditions culinarily speaking based on who your parents were and where they were from. Me? Zip. Nada. I only consider myself lucky to have grown up in a large city where some of the foods of other cultures became everyday foods for our family.

Anyone who can cook the way you do is eligible for "Honorary Italian" status, as far as I'm concerned.

I grew up in a Chinese household, where the oven was used to store plates, and everything was cooked in a hot wok, or a steamer, or a slow cooker.

That must have been some tasty birthday cake that was made in a wok, steamer or slow cooker.

Ha! Birthday cake came from the cake shop. My mother never baked...

I certainly didn't mean any offence by the "white food" comment - apologies if anyone took umbrage.

Isn't umbrage the opposite of white?

Would that be "Burnt Umbrage"?

It would be "Raw Umbrage."

A dish best tasted cold?

That, of course, would be revenge.

I can't tell you how appalled I was the first time I tried rice pudding - ugh.

While I absolutely love Dim Sum, for instance, I do shake my head at some of the items that seem to cause line-ups among my Chinese friends. I can take or leave chicken feet and there is a bland pudding-like item (might be Lo Bak Goh) that leaves me shaking my head.

But then I can't understand other ethnic specialties either - the attraction of schmaltz (chicken fat), and such leave me cold.

I can take or leave chicken feet and there is a bland pudding-like item (might be Lo Bak Goh) that leaves me shaking my head.

Yep, you and BobH and my husband Pete - can't do the chicken's feet. I guess it's something you grow up with - I love them! When you grow up with something, you either love it and crave it for life, or you're so sick of it that you can't stand it. Pete grew up with stews made from cheap (but I think delicious) cuts of meat like lamb neck chops. To this day, he won't eat what he calls "mystery meat stews".

PS. I remember one of the Grumbles (either Bobby or Winger, I think) telling me chickens spend all their time walking in crap, and that I should remember that next time I eat chicken's feet. Now that thought put me off for a few weeks...

Yep, you and BobH and my husband Pete - can't do the chicken's feet. I guess it's something you grow up with - I love them! When you grow up with something, you either love it and crave it for life, or you're so sick of it that you can't stand it. Pete grew up with stews made from cheap (but I think delicious) cuts of meat like lamb neck chops. To this day, he won't eat what he calls "mystery meat stews".

PS. I remember one of the Grumbles (either Bobby or Winger, I think) telling me chickens spend all their time walking in crap, and that I should remember that next time I eat chicken's feet. Now that thought put me off for a few weeks...

"C" it must have been Winger that told you that, but I do have a chicken story. Back when I was a lad some 60 or so years ago, I lived on a farm, and later in a small farm town community. We had a chicken house in both locations. Every spring, about when it was time for my Mom to plant her garden, it was time for my brother and I to clean the guano from the hen house. If the temperature was up on that day, that was a miserable job I hated it, but that made my Mom not one whit of difference. she wanted fertilizer!

Tried chicken feet once with a lady (fellow worker) from Beijing and decided that they were not on my list of to do foods. Now your bread...that makes me think of my Mom again. she baked about 12 loaves each and ever week for as long as I can remember.