1986 Barons Edmond Benjamin Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

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Re: 1986 Baron Rothchild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Elie Poltorak » Mon Nov 12, 2012 11:47 pm

Don't get too excited. If it's drinkable I'll eat my hat.
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Re: 1986 Baron Rothchild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Gabriel Geller » Tue Nov 13, 2012 4:57 am

Elie Poltorak wrote:Don't get too excited. If it's drinkable I'll eat my hat.

If I were you I'd have not commited to do that... :lol:
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1986 Baron Edmonds de Rothchild Haut Medoc TN

Postby Yehoshua Werth » Tue Nov 13, 2012 11:07 am

WOW....
1986 Baron Edmonds de Rothschild
Grabbed the knife and cut off the metal foil and found a normal looking top sans a Bissell (little) slight mold which is totally normal on a bottle like this... I was very surprised that it was not a fungus-fest.

Cork was wet up to about 3/4, soft, yet firm on the pull... Came out like silk... And Ahhh Yes... Bursting with Cherries, Green peppers, Chalkiness, earth and light spice... Lively to say the least!

Color is a dense in the glass and yes really dense for wine that was so thought gone that so is not!
Rouge, cherry brick & only a slight hint of some bronzing at the edges...

Legs were not rocks but held the glass nicely...

People of the community this wine is viscous, silky and gentle with a load of wonderful subtle flavors and DO NOT DECANT!
Nice medium finish and it drinks too nicely and the people I was sharing this with well; we wanted to pour until gone WOW...

More details to come... Drinking again today... Again the fruit was soft and supple and even the acid structure was present with very light creamy tannins. :) WOW am having checked out by a sommelier will relay what we find.

Love be with our day and please always be open to things working that look like they just might not…
We talked with Professor Bravdo about this wine 6 months ago and he said if all the conditions are right it SHOULD HAVE HELD and it did(he did study and work in France)… 92 Points(for me) 87 for everyone else :) Drink NOW
Last edited by Yehoshua Werth on Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1986 Baron Edmonds de Rothchild Haut Medoc TN

Postby Elchonon Hellinger » Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:29 pm

Yehoshua Werth wrote:WOW....
1986 Baron Edmonds de Rothschild
Grabbed the knife and cut off the metal foil and found a normal looking top sans a Bissell (little) slight mold which is totally normal on a bottle like this... I was very surprised that it was not a fungus-fest.

Cork was wet up to about 3/4, soft, yet firm on the pull... Came out like silk... And Ahhh Yes... Bursting with Cherries, Green peppers, Chalkiness, earth and light spice... Lively to say the least!

Color is a dense in the glass and yes really dense for wine that was so thought gone that so is not!
Rouge, cherry brick & only a slight hint of some bronzing at the edges...

Legs were not rocks but held the glass nicely...

People of the community this wine is viscous, silky and gentle with a load of wonderful subtle flavors and DO NOT DECANT!
Nice medium finish and it drinks too nicely and the people I was sharing this with well; we wanted to pour until gone WOW...

More details to come... Drinking again today... Again the fruit was soft and supple and even the acid structure was present with very light creamy tannins. :) WOW am having checked out by a sommelier will relay what we find.

Love be with our day and please always be open to things working that look like they just might not…
We talked with Professor Bravdo about this wine 6 months ago and he said if all the conditions are right it SHOULD HAVE HELD and it did(he did study and work in France)… 92 Points Drink NOW



#1 mazal tov
#2 i want some
#3 when do we get to see elie eat his hat ?!

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: 1986 Baron Rothchild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Elie Poltorak » Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:11 am

Sorry Yehoshua, my father (who attended Yehoshua's grand uncorking) tells me the wine was totally over the hill. I think you got yourself so psyched up about it, you can't face reality ;-) If you really want to convince me, I'd be happy to try some next time I'm in Monsey... If you're right, I'll eat my hat on your next youtube video. :lol:
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Re: 1986 Baron Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Yehoshua Werth » Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:40 pm

Just had the Rep from C&R a Native Frenchy taste it and say how surprised how nice it is...

And drank with 3 people also that night who were also surprised it held well + 3 more the next day...
Mind you everyone said it would be dead... And as your father smelled the fruit NOT Vinagar (ask again... He was not at the Corking just got a sample from me and shared his great smile:) )


Interesting?

Just tasted with Man who work's for a large Bordeau Portfolio for 3 Years and is training in a Masters class in wine and said Perfect balance, great finish 2 minutes and was not "" over the hill...


THE deal is this everyone has a different way of receiving wine in the mind and did someone eat or drink before hand and even just the air around
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Re: 1986 Barons Edmond Benjamin Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Elie Poltorak » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:38 pm

Yehoshua,
If the wine is stored properly and the cork holds up, it won't turn to vinegar so fast. That doesn't mean it's not dead. Like I said, I'd love to try some myself but I cannot believe this wine has anything left in it. It was already almost dead (lasted about 30 seconds after pouring into glass) last time I tried it at my sister's sheva brochos 11 years ago and those bottles were perfectly cellared (several bottles were opened so it wasn't just 1 bad bottle). I stand by my offer to eat my hat if I'm wrong, but some Frenchy's opinion won't convince me. :lol:
On a more serious note, the purpose of long-term cellaring is to bring out added complexity/maturity and make the wine better--not a contest as to which line can last longest without turning to vinegar. What's the point of saving an expensive wine for 25 years when it then tastes worse than a $10 bottle?
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Re: 1986 Barons Edmond Benjamin Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Yehoshua Werth » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:10 pm

"What's the point of saving an expensive wine for 25 years when it then tastes worse than a $10 bottle?"

Agree!

YET this is not the case...

Someone who had this and it was the Fav bottle of a lifetime and tasted it the way it is and knew what it was ... Yeah maybe a let down YET as a wine it drank better than ave for sure and the Balance was close to perfect...

Too bad I only had one shot at this... Youtube of it coming in the next day :)

Look to sharing a L'Chaim with you soon :)
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Re: 1986 Barons Edmond Benjamin Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Stacey B » Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:33 am

Stopped by for taste last night. After being opened for 3 days, I can attest that it was not dead. It had fruit that easily slid of the tongue and silky tannins and a taste of butterscotch at the finish.
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Re: 1986 Barons Edmond Benjamin Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Craig Winchell » Fri Nov 16, 2012 1:51 pm

If I may weigh in, though I never recently tasted the wine in question, people have different tolerances to oxidation. I have rarely found even tremendously oxidized wines to be totally devoid of fruit. On the other hand, once red wines reach a stage of butterscotchy finish, I have found that they would typically be over-the-hill from my taste perpective. I do not have a high tolerance for oxidation in wines typically not meant to be oxidized. That does not mean exceptions do not exist. I remember one memorable bottle of my Black Muscat that, while tremendously oxidized, retained balance, fruit and interest- infact, it was more interesting than the young wine- though most bottles did not age so gracefully.

In any case, we know that psychology has a lot to do with perception of wine. Two people may taste the same wine and perceive two different things. The hopeful proponent of a wine may legitimately perceive a not-yet-dead wine, while the detractor who would eat his hat, if tasting the wine, might legitimately perceive a dead wine.

I would also point out that "dead" does not mean vinegar. It is rare to find an acetic wine these days, no matter how old. Acetic Acid just doesn't normally form in large concentrations unless catalyzed by something, such as the enzymes present in certain bacteria. Aldehydes, on the other hand, are common in old, oxidized wines, where their production occurs spontaneously over time.

Reserving judgment on this particular bottle, I will say that my perception of the Barons Eddie and Benny is that it was a mediocre example of Bordeaux wine, that early on taught me what I did not like about the kosher consumer. I remember in particular the first Kosherfest, where Royal was pouring a number of wines, including that Baron Eddie and Benny, and I was pouring a number, including my '86 Cab. Someone came up to me and tasted the '86 Cab, and his face lit up. "This is one of the 2 best wines here", he said (Forgive me for paraphrasing and calling it a quote, but the story works best in quotes). "There is only 1 wine here better than this, the Barons Edmund and Benjamin Rothschild. It goes down like water!" Of course, I am looking to produce wine which goes down like wine, not wine which goes down like water, but it showed me the value of perception of quality in the kosher market, as opposed to true quality. At least at that time, the kosher market wanted something easy to drink, like water, but the mention of which would create an impact on others. Thankfully, I never bought into that philosophy. Thankfully, too, there are now others who share my views in that respect.
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Re: 1986 Barons Edmond Benjamin Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Gabriel Geller » Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:46 pm

Craig Winchell wrote:"There is only 1 wine here better than this, the Barons Edmund and Benjamin Rothschild. It goes down like water!" Of course, I am looking to produce wine which goes down like wine, not wine which goes down like water, but it showed me the value of perception of quality in the kosher market, as opposed to true quality. At least at that time, the kosher market wanted something easy to drink, like water, but the mention of which would create an impact on others. Thankfully, I never bought into that philosophy. Thankfully, too, there are now others who share my views in that respect.

Craig, I'm totally with you here. Believe it or not but the first time I tasted the Barons Rotschild was at the Royal's european and california portfolio tasting in Tel Aviv last February. I think it was the 2006 vintage because I liked it very much, in fact it was one of the show's best french wines (I must mention here that they were pouring also Léoville Poyferré 2005, Pontet Canet 2003, Royaumont, Montviel etc!) and I'm by far not a "drinking down like water" guy, quite on the contrary. However when I tasted it again several weeks later (but 2007 this time) it was nowhere as good as the wine I had tasted the previous month and was indeed "drinking down like water".
I struggled to get rid of my stock for months until last week a customer specifically told me that he was looking for a good french wine that's easy drinking. I took a bet and handed him a bottle of Rotschild. He came back the following day excited like a teen girl on her way to prom, thanking me like if I had just saved his life and ordered 2 cases! Needless to say that my supplier was very surprised...
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Re: 1986 Barons Edmond Benjamin Rothschild Haut Medoc ?

Postby Yehoshua Werth » Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:08 pm

Had Sommelier analyze this on Thursday night(drinks all wine and is not Jewish, as to say that the wine holds on its own not due to Kosher standards or weak experience level).

=

"Nice mint, leather, Chocolate, some toffee and even Caramel flavors".
"Balanced".
"Silky & smooth and a big surprise on how this aged!"
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