WineLovers Discussion Group

David M. Bueker wrote:Karthauserhof

Who?

Dr. Loosen Wehlener Sonnenuhr Riesling Spaetlese 2005 Wonderful nectarine and juicy machintosh apple fruit. The minerality is there but very understated. It has lots of cats-claws acidity and a little trapped spritz for good measure. The Wehlener Sonnenuhr lends itself sooo well to Spaetlesen in riper vintages. Water-stress is virtually impossible here, bringing balance to even warm vintages. It remains a benchmark site for the mittel-Mosel. Balanced, delicate and as near-perfect as Mosel Riesling gets. There may be more interesting sites, and surely there are those that produce more unique flavors. But nothing says Mosel like a Wehlener Sonnenuhr Spaetlese, and who brings it better than Loosen? (Maybe J.J. Pruem) This is Satisfaction in a glass bottle. 8,0% alc. $25



Prost!
Bill

Following our leader and keeping it going!!!

WTN: `05 Gunderloch Jean Baptiste Riesling Kabinett, Rheinhessen.

Consumed over a 24 hr period, 11%alc, SC, AP# 43790430406. It has been years since I opened a Gunderloch and a few have shown up on a local store`s shelf. This was a deal (for us anyway in AB) at $13.00 Cdn, being a special order that was never picked up from the warehouse!!

Color. Medium straw, no green w. very little cling.

Nose. Very fresh floral with pear, apple, peach and some stonefruit as it airs. No gasolein!

Palate. Initial mouthfeel entry was soft, slight efferescence, loaded with pear and minerally flavors. Everyone who sipped thought terrific acidity, "very easy to drink"....."blows away the Dr.L". Yup, it is on the ripe side but Halbtrocken?? Powerful pear fruit on the finish and some grapefruit after 24 hrs.
Quite like this one and think I am ready to move up the Gunderloch ladder! Terrific length here and went back for 2 more bottles. In fact whilst in the store a buzz went around in 15 mins and shelf was looking pretty empty.

Jay Miller wrote:The one wine I bought was the 2005 Eitelsbacher Karthauserhofberg MSR Riesling Kabinett 3 561 303-08-06. Unlike many '05s this was displaying a crystalline purity and minerality that had some beatiful flesh without being buried in it. My one complaint is that I'm never going to remember the name of this producer and at this point I really want to...

Karthäuserhof rocks! This was perhaps the wine I was most looking forward to when I ordered my sample case of 2005s. Unfortunately a 2003 was packed in my case by mistake and the 2005 had all been sold out by the time the case reached Finland, so I never got it.

Since Bob couldn't find my notes, here are links:

Kees-Kieren

Kurt Hain

Christoffel

Biffar & Haart

Karlsmühle & Haag

I was at first very impressed by these wines, but the more I tasted the less I liked them! Too soft, too 2003-like (despite my initial thoughts that they would have had better structure), too ripe. Maybe I should buy a few more to try again?

-Otto-

Otto,

By missing put on the Karthauserhof you missed some of the best of the vintage IMO. A number of the producers you list there are not in the top tier, and I think this is a vintage where top estates made the top wines. Of course it's also the vintage where I finally admitted to myself that Selbach-Oster is one of the top estates, right up there with Prum, Haag, Haart, etc.

This is not a big acdi vintage, but I'm certain (as certain as possible) that when some of the baby fat fades we will find monumental wines for the ages, especially at the auslese level. And for those who doubt the usefulness of an auslese, please lay some down for 10-15 years then come back to htem. They become so much more complex than just being a "sweet" wine, with layers of flavor that make them stunning at the table. We cellar Bordeaux for 15 years, why not Riesling.

We cellar Bordeaux for 15 years, why not Riesling? Yuo, exactly what I admit to from time to time!!

Time to change.

Obvoiusly I open lots of young Rieslings, but the cellar is overflowing with wines from the mid-late '90s that will be just lovely in a few more years.

Bob Parsons Alberta. wrote:Following our leader and keeping it going!!!

WTN: `05 Gunderloch Jean Baptiste Riesling Kabinett, Rheinhessen.

Consumed over a 24 hr period, 11%alc, SC, AP# 43790430406. It has been years since I opened a Gunderloch and a few have shown up on a local store`s shelf. This was a deal (for us anyway in AB) at $13.00 Cdn, being a special order that was never picked up from the warehouse!!

Color. Medium straw, no green w. very little cling.

Nose. Very fresh floral with pear, apple, peach and some stonefruit as it airs. No gasolein!

Palate. Initial mouthfeel entry was soft, slight efferescence, loaded with pear and minerally flavors. Everyone who sipped thought terrific acidity, "very easy to drink"....."blows away the Dr.L". Yup, it is on the ripe side but Halbtrocken?? Powerful pear fruit on the finish and some grapefruit after 24 hrs.
Quite like this one and think I am ready to move up the Gunderloch ladder! Terrific length here and went back for 2 more bottles. In fact whilst in the store a buzz went around in 15 mins and shelf was looking pretty empty.

Hi Bob,

This wine is my house white. Right now I am drinking the 2003 Gunderloch 'Jean Baptiste'. I am actually building a vertical of this wine and now I have 2000 - 2003. Have not seen the 2004 or 2005 yet in Ontario. Hope they show up soon. This wine is usually made in the halbtrocken style. Really dependable quality wine. One of my all time favorite rieslings.

Tom,

Be careful with the 2000. Many of the 2000s are touchy with age.

David

By missing put on the Karthauserhof you missed some of the best of the vintage IMO

Which is further confirmation that the Saar was especially blessed in 05? Can't wait try them.

I had the lovely von Hovels and Zillikens, can only imagine about the Mullers (especially after the note on ebob about the $2000 TBA).

I was especially disappointed by the Muller-Catoirs and positive reviews to the contrary do not personally find them compelling post-2001.

I had a few of the Muller Catoir 05s and found them a bit rich and rollicking, although certainly fun, and if I had more time I wouldn't mind trying them in more detail. That said, am curious if you have you tried the MC 04s? for someone with our type of palate that may be a vintage to give more immediate pleasure, and I liked what little I tasted, although of course I have no experience with whatever glory existed at MC pre-01.

Rahsaan wrote:

By missing put on the Karthauserhof you missed some of the best of the vintage IMO

Which is further confirmation that the Saar was especially blessed in 05? Can't wait try them.

Except that Karthauserhof is in the Ruwer.

Except that Karthauserhof is in the Ruwer.

Yes, that would put a wrinkle in my analysis!

Wow, chink im the armour there Rahsaan!!!!!!!!

Bob Parsons Alberta. wrote:Wow, chink im the armour there Rahsaan!!!!!!!!

Yes, we're all allowed to slip now and again..

David M. Bueker wrote:Tom,

Be careful with the 2000. Many of the 2000s are touchy with age.

David

Hi David,

Yes, I know that 2000 was an off vintage year for German riesling so it may not age as well. I am also somewhat concerned that all the rieslings have synthetic corks and may age faster than normal. But, I enjoyed lots of 2000s (and the other 3 years) when they were young. I can take a chance on one bottle for aging to build up a vertical.

Tom N. wrote:

David M. Bueker wrote:Tom,

Be careful with the 2000. Many of the 2000s are touchy with age.

David

Hi David,

Yes, I know that 2000 was an off vintage year for German riesling so it may not age as well. I am also somewhat concerned that all the rieslings have synthetic corks and may age faster than normal. But, I enjoyed lots of 2000s (and the other 3 years) when they were young. I can take a chance on one bottle for aging to build up a vertical.

The 2000 Von Schubert's I've tried seem to have the acid-wash to age. Granted, there's not alot of fruit behind the acid, but enough to keep for 5 or 6 years.

And Synthetic Corks?? A travesty for both Muscadet and the Mosel! Who is using these and on what bottlings?

J. J. Christoffel used fake corks on some 2002 Kabinetts. There's not been much other use that I have seen. Screwcaps are gaining a significant foothold though. Even Rheinhold Haart kabinett has screwcaps!

Mark S wrote:[And Synthetic Corks?? A travesty for both Muscadet and the Mosel! Who is using these and on what bottlings?

Hi Mark,

These wines are Gunderloch riesling kabinett 'Jean Baptiste' They have had synthetic corks since 1999, that I know of. I have not noticed any off tastes in the wines yet.

But now Gunderloch is using screwcap, as they noticed issues with the fake corks.

Slightly off topic, but it's my thread so...

2005 Kurt Darting Durkheimer Steinberg Muskateller Kabinett Trocken (Pfalz)
Gorgeous Muscat nose of flowers, orange zest and herb. The fruit is sweet, but the wine is nearly dry (I'm guessing 6-8 g/l of residual unmentionable) with citrus flavors and a persistent, sweetly fruity finish. Delicious stuff at a great price (under $12).

I'm going to keep this thread alive if it kills me...

2005 Selbach-Oster Bernkasteler Badstube Riesling Spatlese*
This is an impressive wine. It smells of flowers, fruit and even a brothy richness that defies characterization as wine. The palate is concentrated but also taut, like a string about to snap. The depth and length are striking as well. The balance is tipped slightly more towards acid than is typical for 2005, and that makes this an even more enticing drink for me. Laura says Wow! I say stunning!

Considering that this sells for around or under $25, I would nominate it as one of the best values of the year.

Keep `em coming. I would post if I could find something suitable!! All `04`s here.

David M. Bueker wrote:But now Gunderloch is using screwcap, as they noticed issues with the fake corks.

That's true David.

My 2004 Gunderloch riesling kabinett is screwcapped!