Côtes du Rhône - QPR Champion of red wines?

[David M. Bueker]

Sitting here sipping on a bottle of 2005 Domaine de l'Ameillaud Côtes du Rhône Villages Cairanne, and I ended up reflecting on all the great value wines I have had over the last several months/years that bear the humble Côtes du Rhône moniker (with or without a village appendage). Whether from Texier, Clos du Mont Olivet, Segrieres, Domaine de la Garrigue or a bunch of other well known or less known sources I have rarely been disappointed.

There's a great diversity of styles based on blend, location & producer. It's rare to find one that is a total goop fest. And best of all the vast majority are under $20 (lots still under $15), with a wine over $40 being almost as rare as hen's teeth (e.g. Bressy's Rasteau).

For a little while I thought Beaujolais was the QPR king, but I think I will have to cede the title to Côtes du Rhône.

New producer to me.
I think CdR can produce excellent value- but there's also a ton o' crap!

New producer to me.
I think CdR can produce excellent value- but there's also a ton o' crap!

What are the American wine merchants doing, if they let the crap land over there?

I'm with David that CDR and CDRV provide some of the best QPR going.

[David M. Bueker]

There's a lot less crap than there used to be. Of course the string of vintages since 1998 have helped a lot.

I have really enjoyed the few 2007s I have had so far.

Actually my flip response is quite inaccurate. I should have said there are some excellent values , but lots of wines I personally find boring. It's actually pretty rare to see truly crappy CdR - usually if I run across, it's a really cheap unknown maker (actually probably a negoce "brand"). Then there are some huge negoce labels like Jaboulet P45, the base Perrin , Delas, where there is a bit of variability (probably inevitable in the quantities these are produced in). Very rarely crappy, but not consistent and seldom great. Once you get into estate CdRs from respected producers, the quality and consistency go up (but I do find some a bit goopy). But I also am not the biggest Grenache fan in the world, so my view is a bit "tainted."

[David M. Bueker]

One of the nice things about the Domaine de l'Ameillaud is that it has 25% Syrah in it. That makes it distinctive when compared to the vast majority of cuvees where Grenache makes up 90%+ of the blend.

One of the nice things about the Domaine de l'Ameillaud is that it has 25% Syrah in it. That makes it distinctive when compared to the vast majority of cuvees where Grenache makes up 90%+ of the blend.

Not really that distinctive from Cairanne, or Vacqueyras or the Cdrs from nearby, all of which use more blending grapes and sometimes quite a bit of Syrah. I'm not a big fan of a lot of Syrah in Southern Rhone wines as it ripens easily and can easily lead to goop. But I find so many exceptions in CdRs from the area, that I consider this a rough rule of thumb ready to be downgraded to a useful prejudice about which one should be suspicious nevertheless.

One of the nice things about the Domaine de l'Ameillaud is that it has 25% Syrah in it. That makes it distinctive when compared to the vast majority of cuvees where Grenache makes up 90%+ of the blend.

Not really that distinctive from Cairanne, or Vacqueyras or the Cdrs from nearby, all of which use more blending grapes and sometimes quite a bit of Syrah. I'm not a big fan of a lot of Syrah in Southern Rhone wines as it ripens easily and can easily lead to goop. But I find so many exceptions in CdRs from the area, that I consider this a rough rule of thumb ready to be downgraded to a useful prejudice about which one should be suspicious nevertheless.

Prof,
You obviously have much more on-the-ground info on this than I do, but I'd suspect that the more interesting examples of S Rhone Syrah come from those domaines at higher elevation, especially those on the slopes of the Dentelles. Any support for this hypothesis?

Mark Lipton

[David M. Bueker]

Not really that distinctive from Cairanne, or Vacqueyras or the Cdrs from nearby, all of which use more blending grapes and sometimes quite a bit of Syrah.

True, but I was more comparing it to the vast ocean of Côtes du Rhône bottlings.

One of the stores here has a L`Ameillaud red as their house red.

Here is a note from previous thread here last year....>

WTN: `05 Domaine de l`Ameillaud, Rhone.

70% Grenache, 10% Syrah, 20% Carignan. 14% alc, good natural cork, $16 Cdn

Has some resemblance to a Cairanne I thought. Dark ruby in color, nose was an appealing blackcurrant, spice, earth, herbal quality as it warmed. To me, pretty classic.
Excellent palate with raspberry, medium tannins, good structure balance. Found some spice as it opened and filled out very nicely. Good deal considering our high prices.
60 participants in the tasting, some newbies, but very well liked overall. Will post other wines asap.

[David M. Bueker]

Interesting note on the cepage, as the card in the case I have quotes the Syrah at 25%. Weird.

I think Côtes du Rhône is 'safe'. Some are better than others(Coudoulet de Beaucastel is more expensive than many, but is consistlanty good) but I don't think I've ever had one so bad that I wouldn't drink it.
So I'd second the nomination as QPR champ!

R

I agree about CdR being good value.

Its a good choice on a unknown restaurant wine list

There's a great diversity of styles based on blend, location & producer. It's rare to find one that is a total goop fest. And best of all the vast majority are under $20 (lots still under $15), with a wine over $40 being almost as rare as hen's teeth (e.g. Bressy's Rasteau).

For a little while I thought Beaujolais was the QPR king, but I think I will have to cede the title to Côtes du Rhône.

Nice note, and very true re. their diversity and quality at a really decent price point - I do need to drink more CdRs and explore some of the small producers there further. What I've had so far in the $10-20 price range has generally been very solid and consistent and I've heard all sorts of good things about the '07 vintage - once the weather's a bit cooler in fall will have to start exploring some of the '07 CDRs.

Mark,

I don't know if more Syrah occurs more safely with more Dentelles exposure in Gigondas. It's a good guess, but to know, I'd have to know a lot more about proportions of vineyards going into which wines than I begin to. With regard to Vacqueyras, the only domaine that has any Dentelles vineyards, I think, is Clos de Caveau. Domaines de la Garrigue, whose wines I have as much enthusiasm for as Parker, has high Syrah content in its regular Vacqueyras--the one we see here--and has a cuvée that is 50% Syrah that I only see there and that I do like very much.

I do think cooler places should produce better Syrah and Fonsalette would be the obvious example. And I find myself less tolerant as one moves further south to CdP where I really find that high Syrah blends are not to my taste.

Coinkidinkally, David, when I was in the Rhone, I visited Ameillaud and had the pleasure of taking lunch with the altogether urbane and charming proprietor/manager, Nick. English transplant that came to the Rhone many, many years ago to manage for the then owners, and loved it so much he now calls it home.

Not only are his wines splendid, but he serves up a great lunch al fresco (even when the Mistral is blowing), with freshly made fougasse to start, supplemented by a host of locally prepared cold foods and the inevitable (and hugely appreciated) platter of cheeses.

To my delight, we cracked open a delicious rose' (Nick loooooves rose' and thinks it the perfect al fresco wine; obviously, I agree), then proceeded to the wine of which you wrote.

Don't have my notes at hand, but I do specifically recall Nick talking about the strong influence of Syrah as being a marker for his wines. I'll dig out the notes when I get a chance (process of recovering from our move right now, and all is chaos) and see what info I have on this.

Dale: I'd agree with your list, with the exception of Delas. I've found them to be much more reliable than you, apparently. Granted, they are stronger by far in the northern Rhones (understatement of the week), but I've still been pretty lucky with their lesser light CdRs. Otherwise, spot on. And the incredible dive that P45 took is one of the more shameful episodes in Rhone wines. What it was then, and what it is now---the difference is hard to describe, but easy to mourn.

There's a great diversity of styles based on blend, location & producer. It's rare to find one that is a total goop fest. And best of all the vast majority are under $20 (lots still under $15), with a wine over $40 being almost as rare as hen's teeth (e.g. Bressy's Rasteau).

For a little while I thought Beaujolais was the QPR king, but I think I will have to cede the title to Côtes du Rhône.

Nice note, and very true re. their diversity and quality at a really decent price point - I do need to drink more CdRs and explore some of the small producers there further. What I've had so far in the $10-20 price range has generally been very solid and consistent and I've heard all sorts of good things about the '07 vintage - once the weather's a bit cooler in fall will have to start exploring some of the '07 CDRs.

Salil, you're in for a treat. Recently had the opp to sample through many of the properties (often with the winemakers) through the Villages, focusing on 2005/6/7. The 2005s are lovely; the 2007s obviously in a more primal stage, but also delicious and actually forward/friendly drinking right now. Herr Doktor Professor Loesberg can give you bell, book and candle much more than I ever could on the various and sundry producers, of course (and I hope he will, enlightenment being appreciated).

But the 2007s are standouts!

One of the nice things about the Domaine de l'Ameillaud is that it has 25% Syrah in it. That makes it distinctive when compared to the vast majority of cuvees where Grenache makes up 90%+ of the blend.

Some of my favourite CDRV producers also use a lot of Mourvèdre. Oratoire Saint-Martin (Alary brothers) have 60% Mourvèdre in their Haut-Coustias and 40% in Prestige; I think that the former contravenes the appellation rules -sshhhh.

My local merchant just sold be a 3L 'box' of the 2007 Alain Jaume & Fils Reserve Grand Veneur CDR. (I only went in to by a small bottle of bitters!) I've never bought a box of wine before (unless my mother-in-law was coming to town) Your posts give me hope that this wine with live up to its fancy name. 70% Grenache, 20% Syrah and 10% Cinsault.

My local merchant just sold be a 3L 'box' of the 2007 Alain Jaume & Fils Reserve Grand Veneur CDR. (I only went in to by a small bottle of bitters!) I've never bought a box of wine before (unless my mother-in-law was coming to town) Your posts give me hope that this wine with live up to its fancy name. 70% Grenache, 20% Syrah and 10% Cinsault.

Hey, Jon, it's quite common (especially among the co-ops, of which there are some credible ones) to have their tasting/sales rooms stuffed with BinB wines of good AOC at modest (compared to the export grade stuff in bottles that is) prices.

In Cave de Tain, Tain l'Hermitage, I saw St-Peray, Saint-Joseph, and Crozes-Hermitage in boxes ranging from 3L to 10L, and they seemed to be selling briskly. Obviously, to the 'locals' and not to the Murkans.

In Caves de Caractere Vacqueyras I saw similar in their rather elaborate tasting/sales room.

It's amusing to me that the local people, many of whom make these fine wines they export to the rest of the world at high prices, are quite amenable to drinking more modest versions of the appelations in things like BinB, whereas most Americans would consider the same anathema, and turn their noses up at it as being 'beneath' them.

Then, of course, many of those same Americans will go to Europe, find a charming and authentic little bistro and rave about their house wine and carafe wine as being the real and authentic thing and why can't they sell wines like this in America at this price!!!!!! Of course, those wines quite likely just got tapped out of a BinB sitting on a shelf in the back room.

I thought....very briefly...about setting up an operation where I could specialize in bringing in some of these classy AOCs strictly in BinB and distributing them in stores where the people knew what the hell they were doing and had patrons that simply enjoyed decent wine for good price...then I came to my senses, thank the meatballs! I chalk that up to the same category as opening a quaint B&B or starting a cozy little restaurant.

David,

I couldn't agree more. Of course it was even better when Guigal CdR was $6-7 (and they had access to better fruit back then) but over the last 25 years (the time I've been buying wine) I would definitely agree that CdR wins the red QPR lifetime achievement award.

Dale: I'd agree with your list, with the exception of Delas. I've found them to be much more reliable than you, apparently. Granted, they are stronger by far in the northern Rhones (understatement of the week), but I've still been pretty lucky with their lesser light CdRs. Otherwise, spot on. And the incredible dive that P45 took is one of the more shameful episodes in Rhone wines. What it was then, and what it is now---the difference is hard to describe, but easy to mourn.

I don't have a lot of experience with the Delas. But I bought a couple based on (I think) an enthusiastic note from Claude Kolm a few years ago, and got a wine that didn't resemble description. And got some 2007 Esprit that aren't really bad, but don't seem to match Parker's notes. I found Claude very dependable, and while I maybe didn't always agree with his likes (that's true with everyone), it was unusual to find a wine so different from description. So I wonder about batch variation.

Ah, the P45. My go-to CdR in early 90s. The first group of '95 P45 was a stunning value, but then when I restocked..... Since then, it seems mostly downhill.

The wines that are sold in boxes are generally the wines that used to be sold, and still are, en vrac. Many famous domaines sell a version of such wine, as Hoke says, mostly to the locals. The locals buy these, however, not because they know the "real" wines and Americans will only buy hoighty-toity labels but because they drink wine as a basic beverage and don't care to spend money on a form of wine they would consider a luxury. Domaine make these frequently as part of their being part of a community and to sell to the community. I have tasted some of these wines that would be nearly--though not quite--as good as the domaine's basic CdR and some are thus very good buys. I have never tasted an en vrac or BiB version of a wine nearly as good as the domaine's bottling, even when their bottling was a CdR, much less when it was a Chateauneuf. Americans wanting a glass of the local wine with their dinner as a beverage with dinner could do much worse than drink these wines. But they are quite right not to want to buy them if they want to see what wines an area is capable of. It's like the old saw about seeking out restaurants that truck drivers frequent. Do that, and you will find many places that serve large portions of decent food at reasonable prices, which is, what I would look for if I were a trucker, I'd guess, but you'll never find a restaurant that is worth making a special trip for.

It's like the old saw about seeking out restaurants that truck drivers frequent...

Aren't truck drivers pretty limited in the restaurants they can access?