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Another cocktail moment...

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Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:39 pm

Drinking with a colleague and buddy, Big Jim at a local watering hole:

Jim had a Bruichladdaich. Actually, he had a couple of Bruich-laddies, because they had four versions (has this Scotch thing gone too far?), I think the 12 year and then the Rocks.

I ventured further into the Center of the Manhattan Earth by trying a new combination. First, though, I asked what has to be asked these days, "What's your vermouth(s)?" When the tender showed me a bottle of Noilly Prat Red, I asked for a Manhattan, Up, with Buffalo Trace.

This is a very good combination. The heavy smoky, earthy qualities of the BT match well with the richness of the Noilly and the classic Angostura (thank god and good bartenders, not too much of that), and make an intriguing concoction. Lagniappe was they do their own cherries, so I didn't have to choke down an artificially flavored and colored 'maraschino' either!

Customary MiniRant: At least this bar---which bills itself as a whisky bar----has the basic sense to stock a decent bar vermouth, the Noilly Red. I was in another place recently that makes a big point of using only fresh squeezed juices, has no blenders and no frozen machine, and puts together exotic or elaborte concoctions as signature drinks, along with painstakingly recreated classics------and then it turns out the bar vermouth, and the only vermouth in the house is Lejon. LEJON????? C'mon. Get serious. Why go to all that trouble if you're going to use the cheapest crap vermouth out there?

Unfortunately, that's not uncommon these days. Went to a legendary restaurant bar in Kansas City a few months ago...same thing. All these great classic cocktails, and all they had was one cheap lowball vermouth, and no amari to be had anywhere. Feh.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by James Roscoe » Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:56 pm

Like any of us hoi-poloi can tell the difference? :oops:

(If I drink at a bar with you Hoke, does your company pick up the tab? I promise to talk business for two minutes. :roll: )
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Keith M » Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:00 pm

Hoke wrote:Jim had a Bruichladdaich. Actually, he had a couple of Bruich-laddies, because they had four versions (has this Scotch thing gone too far?)

How did the versions differ? Aging?

Hoke wrote:Why go to all that trouble if you're going to use the cheapest crap vermouth out there?

This rant seems familiar. Have you ever gotten an answer to that question?

Your cocktail moments always make for good reading (as presumably they were for drinking) . . .
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:19 pm

Keith M wrote:
Hoke wrote:Jim had a Bruichladdaich. Actually, he had a couple of Bruich-laddies, because they had four versions (has this Scotch thing gone too far?)

How did the versions differ? Aging?

Hoke wrote:Why go to all that trouble if you're going to use the cheapest crap vermouth out there?

This rant seems familiar. Have you ever gotten an answer to that question?

Your cocktail moments always make for good reading (as presumably they were for drinking) . . .




You'd have to ask Jim, Keith. He was drinking the scotch.

Answer? Generally a blank look, an "I just work here shrug", or an embarrassed "Sucks, but I don't make those decisions" grimace.

And thanks.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Frank Deis » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:18 pm

What I've heard is that several high end bars buy the six dollar vodka and display it in Grey Goose bottles...

Drinking it straight, it's easy to tell the difference. You swirl in some lime juice and grenadine and who the heck knows?

At any rate that's my latest cocktail at home. "Vodka Blush" -- inspired by re-watching "Rosemary's Baby." Tasty, but of course I use Ketel One in it which is probably a waste.

F
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:30 pm

Frank Deis wrote:What I've heard is that several high end bars buy the six dollar vodka and display it in Grey Goose bottles...

Drinking it straight, it's easy to tell the difference. You swirl in some lime juice and grenadine and who the heck knows?

At any rate that's my latest cocktail at home. "Vodka Blush" -- inspired by re-watching "Rosemary's Baby." Tasty, but of course I use Ketel One in it which is probably a waste.

F


Yeah, that's either the straight word or the standard legend, Frank.

Suspect at the low-level bars and dives (you know, the places where...no, I won't go there :D ) they might be doing that. And I'll confess that I knew a bartender who made a habit out of refilling Chivas Regal bottles with King's Ransom Scotch, back when Chivas was the hot back bar scotch.

But honestly, I don't think that's as prevalent as some people might. But you never know...might be an irresistible temptation if you're working for an outfit that's rigid on bar costs.

Thing is, just recently I've been doing a whole series of Spirits Intensive training/tastings for the SWE Certified Specialist of Spirits program, wherein we taste an entire representative panel of vodkas. And yes, Grey Goose does stand out; and it performs pretty well too. And yes, doubters, you can taste the differences in different vodkas. Sometimes faint, sometimes pronounced, but stil there.

And I agree with you, it all depends on what you're using the spirit for. Using Grey Goose in a screwdriver is just plain stupid, just as using Herradura in a frozen margarita would be a total waste of money.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Thomas » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:47 pm

Frank Deis wrote:
At any rate that's my latest cocktail at home. "Vodka Blush" -- inspired by re-watching "Rosemary's Baby."
F



Just watch what Roman slips into your glass...
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Dave Erickson » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:34 pm

The best vermouth I've ever had--by a mile--is made by California Dessert Wine Genius Andrew Quady. It's called "Vya" and it comes in both dry and sweet versions. I was introduced to the stuff years ago by Joe Carbonara, who used to tend bar at the late great Caffe Umbra in Boston. Don't know where he is these days, but he made a mighty fine Negroni.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Paul Winalski » Tue Apr 28, 2009 9:54 pm

Sorry to be one of the Great Unwashed, but what's "Buffalo Trace"? To me it's a synonym for the things you find in the pasture and call "meadow muffins", but found in Yellowstone National Park instead.

Agree about Noilly Prat vermouth vs. your standard domestic US drek.

-Paul W.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Victorwine » Tue Apr 28, 2009 10:25 pm

Straight Bourbon

Salute
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Tue Apr 28, 2009 10:52 pm

Paul Winalski wrote:Sorry to be one of the Great Unwashed, but what's "Buffalo Trace"? To me it's a synonym for the things you find in the pasture and call "meadow muffins", but found in Yellowstone National Park instead.

Agree about Noilly Prat vermouth vs. your standard domestic US drek.

-Paul W.


As Victor said, Bourbon. Owned by Sazerac Company.

BT was the location of one of the more legendary distillation sites in KY history. Name came from a river crossing (you gotta have lots of water for a distillery) where there was a trace of a buffalo crossing.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Tue Apr 28, 2009 11:03 pm

Did some further research to find out the mash bill of Buffalo Trace. Company is being cagey and reluctant to reveal their "unique secret formula" mash bill. They'll vaguely tell you it's corn, rye, and malted barley, but won't go into constituent amounts.

Some bourbon geeks suspect the bill isn't different from their other products (Ancient Age, Blantons, etc.). I don't know, so can't comment.

All I can say is it makes a good Manhattan with Noilly Prat.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Dave R » Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:30 am

Hoke,

I always enjoy your liquor notes/reports. They are nicely detailed and very informative. Speaking of bourbon, have you ever tried any of the Pappy Van Winkle bottlings? Nice stuff.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Mike Filigenzi » Wed Apr 29, 2009 6:06 pm

Dave Erickson wrote:The best vermouth I've ever had--by a mile--is made by California Dessert Wine Genius Andrew Quady. It's called "Vya" and it comes in both dry and sweet versions. I was introduced to the stuff years ago by Joe Carbonara, who used to tend bar at the late great Caffe Umbra in Boston. Don't know where he is these days, but he made a mighty fine Negroni.


We use Vya quite a bit around the house. Very nice stuff with lots of interesting flavors to it.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:32 pm

Dave R wrote:Hoke,

I always enjoy your liquor notes/reports. They are nicely detailed and very informative. Speaking of bourbon, have you ever tried any of the Pappy Van Winkle bottlings? Nice stuff.


Yes, I've had most of the Van Winkles, and I think Julian does a superb job with them all. The Rye is spectacular, and the fully aged bourbons are just as impressive, Dave.

Trouble is that VW is a self-consuming creature---each barrel they broach and blend hurries the end, because they haven't produced any new product for a long time. VW doesn't have a distillery, so they're using existing barrel stock.

But, yeah, they are all top notch.

And re Vya, Quady does a super job with that. I agree it's a great vermouth.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Dave R » Sun May 03, 2009 8:36 pm

Hoke,

Thanks for the information on VW.

I was thinking of you last week when my girfriend and I stopped for a drink before meeting some friends at another place for dinner. When we sat down at the bar, we noticed a sign that read:

TODAY'S DRINK SPECIAL

MOJITO'S (ANY FLAVOR)

$4.99


My initial thought was, "Oh, man, Hoke would go nuts if he saw something as stupid as that."

Perhaps next week they will have Gin and Tonics (any flavor) on special. :lol:
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Sun May 03, 2009 10:45 pm

Nah, I wouldn't go nuts, Dave. I'd just sigh a bit and shake my head. :D

It's interesting to me when a drink or cocktail reaches a certain level of fame and notoriety that it begins to go through an arc, from a distinct (and usually quite simple) concoction, such as a Mojito---which is basically white rum, muddled mint and sugar, and soda over ice, created in Cuba basically so they Cubanos could have a light and slightly alcoholic drink for sweltering climes--- which then goes through different variations, as each bartender attempts to put his/her individual stamp on it. Maybe dark rum. Maybe an extra exotic, like ginger. Maybe basil instead of spearmint.

Then, when the drink has become very popular, it is genericized, first by having someone come out with a 'mojito pre-mix'--essentially sugar water with stick mint syrup flavoring, either with or without cheap rum mixed in. Cuts down the cost and time to make the drink---but also removes whatever made it special in the first place, primarily the muddling of the fresh mint. Once the freshness is gone and it's a pre-mix formula, alll the magic is gone.

Then, of course, exotic changes are piled on exotic changes, and the results bear little resemblance to what the original mojito was. And then any old alcohol can be used.

So you end up with either a pre-mix glass of crap or some bizarre concoction that holds no relation to the original drink. And you can't, for the life of you, fin anyone who actually makes a real mojito anymore!

Then, of course, another drink starts the arc... :D

Funny, but a bit sad and predictable at the same time.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Mike Filigenzi » Mon May 04, 2009 11:08 am

I hope there's another phase to that life cycle wherein the people who jump on the bandwagon and consume the generic pre-mix-made stuff get sick of it and jump on the next bandwagon. The pre-mixes die, the cocktail sinks back into relative obscurity, and the only places you can get them are places that will make them properly.

Hasn't really happened with the margarita or the daiquiri yet, I guess, but you never know.
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Re: Another cocktail moment...

by Hoke » Mon May 04, 2009 11:53 am

You see, Mike, I'm such a positive guy (on the upswing end of my cycle) that I see hope even for the margarita and the daiquiri. :D

Yes, they've both been abased, seemingly beyond resurrection, but I still see glimmers of hope out there. Occasionally. Every now and then.

I taught a local place how to make a margarita for me: essentially, hold the goddam simple syrup bath, apply moderate amounts of a good triple sec (Cointreau), and use a good tequila. Not a mixto, in other words. Not necessarily a stratospherically priced one, but at least a moderate 100% agave. If one has to have a little sweetener---not necessary for me----there's always agave nectar.

Same local place now offers a Hemingway, which I've seen in a few places now. So there has been some increase in rum knowledge and use, and there's hope for the daiquiri, I think. Tell the truth, I'm going through an absolute fascination with good rum these days; don't have much use for the basic and ubiquitous white rum. but there are some truly amazing and incredibly aromatic/flavorful rums out there now. Zaya, if the new owners don't screw it up. Ron Centenario. And if you're looking for spirits that show the influence of terroir, so we can incessantly argue about that with other spirits than scotch ( :D ), then rum is where you want to go!

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