WineLovers Discussion Group

Hi All My name is John Nolan New to this Forum,

Just a matter of interest, things that have intrigued me looking into all these wine forums picking and choosing the 1 or two that you want to be appart of and i seem to come accross a re-occuring pattern in the chats and discussions which basically breaks down to Older(Wine) is Better!!! has it to do with a shortage of variety??? I like inox aged Reds and Whites this year, opposed to oak aged whites last year, because they are fresher livelier and summer this year is quite heavy. I can never seem to find an occasion to attempt to open '90-'95 Barolo's, Brunello's or Sagrantino's ecc and most of the time when you attempt to revive them they are already gone or in coma.
I love great Reds and Whites but I'd venture to a max '99(Taurasi) '97(Primitivo di manduria) or even a '02 Chardonnay during this period of the year.

Its just a observation,

I Know starting off with a punch is probably not the best way but its just to get an understanding of how things are!!

Welcome John! Swing for the fences! We like a good opinion. Just dont get started on corks. We are all worn out on that one right now.

I love a good primitivo. It's a great value in an every-day red. I didn't recognize your producer though. My favorite is Rocca die Mora. As for Chardonnay, I generally don't care for the California style, only the white Burgs. Others might chime in. Welcome again!

Welcome, John. I look forward to your participation.
I also enjoyed looking at your web page.

Hi James

I have been delving into some of 'Soloperto' Vinyard's productions they have some '97 primitivos available together with some great natural desert wines. Another wine that I'm finding allot of comfort is called Fara, Near Ghemme north of Italy.

I'm not a great fan of Californian wines myself but this years I'm hoping to prove myself wrong having planned a trip to those parts of the wine world.

Thank you for the welcome,

J Nolan wrote:i seem to come accross a re-occuring pattern in the chats and discussions which basically breaks down to Older(Wine) is Better!!!

Hey, John ... glad you solved that log-in problem, and as the others have said, there's no rule against starting interesting discussions here!

I don't think you'll find a lot of support in <i>this</i> forum for the "Older is Better" theory. Sure, hardly anybody will turn down an occasional glass of a well-cellared ageworthy wine if someone's pouring, but it's not an everyday diet for most of us ...

Robin Garr wrote:

J Nolan wrote:i seem to come accross a re-occuring pattern in the chats and discussions which basically breaks down to Older(Wine) is Better!!!

I don't think you'll find a lot of support in <i>this</i> forum for the "Older is Better" theory.

Robin,
Speak for yourself young man. 50% of what my wife and I drink may be 2-4 years old but give me an old Bordeaux, old Chablis, old Vouvray or old Barolo anytime. When you think of the best wines you have every tasted is it a '02 chard tasted in '04, an '01 cab tasted in '05 or a 20 year old Bordeaux? I am with you Robin on most things but you have to stop making crazy statements, whoops, guess that is a matter of palate preference, sorry.
Walt

wrcstl wrote:Speak for yourself young man. 50% of what my wife and I drink may be 2-4 years old but give me an old Bordeaux, old Chablis, old Vouvray or old Barolo anytime. When you think of the best wines you have every tasted is it a '02 chard tasted in '04, an '01 cab tasted in '05 or a 20 year old Bordeaux? I am with you Robin on most things but you have to stop making crazy statements, whoops, guess that is a matter of palate preference, sorry.

Hey, did I say "old is bad"? I think not!

I'm just saying that most of us don't get to drink a lot of mature wines unless someone like you is pouring. So when's the party?

To say it another way, "Young is not necessarily bad", or "Old wine is not the only wine worth drinking."

Sam Platt wrote:To say it another way, "Young is not necessarily bad", or "Old wine is not the only wine worth drinking."

Sam,
I agree but Robin said "I don't think you'll find a lot of support in this forum for the "Older is Better" theory." To my palate, with some exceptions, I disagree and find older wine nuances much more interesting than early drinking flavors. Realize this is a personal preference but you probably will find quite a bit of support for this on the forum. Regardless, we need to keep him under control and call him out on occassion.
Walt

Welcome, John. I like your website very much, and hope you'll stay and discuss wines.

In my case, variety is the spice -- over the past two months, wines have ranged from a few cool evenings with an 1832 Madiera to a 2005 Prosecca -- no real pattern, frankly.

I monitor a number of wine boards, and haven't really seen a bias toward young or old wines.

Regards, Bob

Bob, where is the website you are talking about?!!

http://www.romanwineco.com/ Bob.

Glance up to John's first post. On the bottom right, just after the end of his post, there's a button called W W W . Click on that button, and you'll get to his website.

I think you can add any websight to your posts by entering it in your Profile.

I see that Robin has one in his posts as well. Bucko does too -- don't remember anyone else at the moment.

Regards, Bob

Welcome, John. After "comparison shopping," hope you'll find this forum as hospitable as any (perhaps even moreso). Since I drink from the Boot pretty regularly myself, I noticed that the wines you mention most specifically were Italian. Does that reflect your preference?

Walt wrote:Regardless, we need to keep him under control and call him out on occassion.

Walt, You're right. We don't want our "Grand Poo-bah" to become intellectually sloppy.

My problem is that I have not had the opportunity to taste many old wines. Primarily because my pocket book objects to it. I can't really talk intelligently about the subject. I'm limited to what is currently available for the most part. I would guess that 80% of the board is in the same situation. That doen't mean that I don't enjoy reading notes about older wines. I find the posts by Francois Audouze very interesting.

Thanks,

Bob, one other thing about the W W W button.

If you go to the Members button on the top of the page, click on it, in the drop down menu called Select sort method: , click on Website, change the Order menu to Descending, then click on Sort, you'll get a list of all folks who have entered a web address and of course you can go to them by clicking on the W W W button.

Regards, Bob

Hi Sam

its pretty difficult to get my hands on other Foreign wines so we've basically an italian Base some french and maybe some German, what I'm restricted to here so to say, Italy for variety is not restricting, I make up for when abroad, in canada last week had some Ice wine(interesting), love wine from lanzarotte, and have some spainish wines sitting around, and as I mentioned above california for me this year. maybe you can suggest some wines from there for me to keep an eye out for!! I'll try to be as open as possible here.

Cheers
john

Sam Platt wrote:

Walt wrote:Regardless, we need to keep him under control and call him out on occassion.

Walt, You're right. We don't want our "Grand Poo-bah" to become intellectually sloppy.

My problem is that I have not had the opportunity to taste many old wines. Primarily because my pocket book objects to it. I can't really talk intelligently about the subject. I'm limited to what is currently available for the most part. I would guess that 80% of the board is in the same situation. That doen't mean that I don't enjoy reading notes about older wines. I find the posts by Francois Audouze very interesting.

Thanks,

Sam,
We can correct that if you are ever in St. Louis. The "go to" region is Bordeaux but have a few Italians and a few cabs that are 15+ years old.
Walt

John
Welcome.
I reckon different occasions warrant different wines and it's great to have a spread to choose from.
Age is also a moveable target, as say a Langhe Nebbiolo may acquire a nice balance after (say) 3-4 years, showing some secondary character. However a Barolo might not shift much for 10 years. Meanwhile a Novello Rosso is fine for a refreshing drink on a summers day.

I guess what I'm trying to say is there's no rule that says we should always drink older wines and enjoy them better. We probably write more bacause we find them more interesting - maybe even the age justifies a few more words!

I do agree with your view on Italy's variety - an incredibly diverse traditional range, now augmented by more international styles.

Looking forward to hearing of your experiences in Italy and any interesting wines/wine bars/restaurants - I try to be a regular tourist to Italy

regards

Ian

Hi Ian

let me know when and where you intend to go and I'll try to see that your satisfied with the region and what it'll offer.


John

John, welcome to the group. Pull up a stool, stay awhile. And like a few others, I don't hear the "older is better" thing here. What I *DO* think this site has to offer is a very well-rounded appreciation for all well-made wines both young and old, and if there's one subgroup here with a bias, then it's the large number of Americans who tend to drink European wines.

I realize that I've been very lucky to have a retailer in my area with a good cellar, so I'm still able to buy '70s Bordeaux and '80s Burgundy off the shelf, though most of what's left never got good Parker reviews! In fact, this is often the case with what you find at auctions, etc., at least at reasonable prices!

The "trick" with many older wines is serving them right! This is especially true if the wine is weaker, or the vintage so-so. For the most part, they often benefit greatly from a lot of slow aeration, from just pulling the cork 6, 8, or 10 hours ahead of time. Then decanting isn't necessary (or desirable) to accomplish proper aeration.

A good older wine is non-aggressive and subtle. So when I am in the mood for a whole bottle (by myself, as I am a single guy...), I look for something reasonably mature.

Then there is the problem, with younger-to-middle-aged wines, that they can be closed and not showing all that well. So you have to know the style of vintages, and what sort of decanting etc. will help them show best, whether they are young OR old! ...Paul