WineLovers Discussion Group

MarkE wrote:A related question: Why the designation of négociant-éleveur for one who buys grapes and makes wine, since éleveur seems to indicate only the élevage, which is what a "regular" négociant does? Wouldn't it make more sense to call such an operation négociant-vinifieur or négociant-vinifieur-éleveur?

Well, "regular" negociants might not do that, right? In Burgundy at least I think it's fairly common for negociants to buy finished wine. So a negociants might be buying grapes (which they might or might not have some input on the growing of), might be buying wine which they then do the elevage on (this would be the Dominique Laurent method, with the negociant putting their stamp on the wine that way), or might buy finished barrels of wine.

Agree with Bob Ross. I was going to write the same, but I scanned first to see if someone else beat me to the punch (or the wine as the case may be).

If we can agree upon a conventional definition, why not use the original term since it is pretty much a technical term?[/quote]

Alex, I've read that there is a growing trend in the more expensive areas like Burgundy for "Domains" to split themselves into "Domains" and "Negociants". There is apparently a tax reason for doing so: the "Negociant" can then buy the grapes from the "Domain".

If this is in fact true, all the more reason to use the French words to describe the entity that produces and labels the wine.

Alex,

I think we in the States equate the word negociant with Burgundy because they are the most common examples we see, and the distinction between domaine and negociant is one that everyone learns. I cannot even THINK of any negociant-bottled Bordeaux I have seen here in the last 10 years! OTOH, I haven't been looking either. I remember a Bordeaux called "My Cousin's Claret" bottled by Sichel. back in the '70s though!

There are so many small Chateau wines, and second labels of classified growths, that are priced under $20, and so much wine from all parts of the world at a lower price point, that I don't think there is any particular demand for negociant Bordeaux....?

In general, I think the wine press manages to identify the quality level among negociants these days, so not only is wine being made in a much better manner, by everyone, but the consumer is better informed, and the underachiever, and the overachiever, are both quickly identified by the marketplace, and "punished" or rewarded, accordingly! I think! ...Paul